God
i'm thinking with all the innovative materials out there, could we all just simply wear cold weather suits, and rest our heads where ever we preferred at night?
imagine it, a whole group of people who have realized that humanity really no longer has need for traditional shelters, such as houses, tents, RV's etc
my idea is just for people to wear these cold weather suits all the time ... like this one http://www.clamcorpstore.com/SearchResult.aspx?CategoryID=342 and just lay down on the ground at night, and just wash the suit when it needs it
are there other suits that would work better than this?
i would imagine the gumby looking suits alaskan fisherman wear would work, but they are not usually too stylish
what think you all of this idea?
and suggestions on better suits are welcome ... i know "aerogel" is looking very promising as a cold weather insolater
ok willie, you're sassy but you raise some good points ... are any of you familiar with this parka/cold weather suit/sleeping bag/tentish thing, that the nazi soldiers used in WW2? .. plenty of room for dead air in that, especially with todays materials, but i can't remember what it was called ???
Answer
The whole point of taking a shelter and sleeping bag is to get out of the winter clothes that are either A) Sweaty; B) Soaking Wet; or C) Both. When you stop for the night your body temperature will drop because you are not moving around. Fall asleep outside in the fishing suit or a snow suit and you'll get a crappy night sleep at best. At worse you'll die from hypothermia. A sleeping bag harnesses the core temperature and the dead air keeps your arms and legs warm. Your arms and legs will be much colder with just wearing a suit to sleep in because the blood going into the extremities will slow down.
Eventually the body just says "F-it, I'm not pumping blood to the freakin' arms because it just comes back cold. I'm gonna save my heart and brain and give this dumbass gangrene."
It's also not that innovative. It looks like a ski jacket and mountaineering pants I bought about 10 years ago. It's not even Gore-Tex. Some no-name "waterproof/breathable" material...probably the same crap they put in our ski patrol jackets.
I'd trust a high-altitude mountaineering snowsuit before I tried that fishing suit.
Oh yeah...the tent. It creates a dead air space that helps reduce the effects of windchill. So with the suit you got an inch or so dead air between you and -30 degree winds...and in the tent it's a toasty 5 above.
Edit: I have no idea about what the Nazis used. I have a book on WWII uniforms and gear someplace. I'll check it out. On the other hand...Wouldn't it be better to see what the Russians used? After all, the Krauts got their butts kicked on the Eastern Front. (Is it something like a bivy-sack?)
Additionally: In the worse case scenario you could always just bury yourself in a snow cave like a polar bear. In that event, a suit like this would have some practical applications, but I still don't think it's ideal.
More: I bet this is warmer:
http://www.mountainhardwear.com/Product.aspx?top=1621&prod=1311&cat=1662&viewAll=False
I bet this kicks butt too:
http://www.hellyhansen.com/product/OnePieces/OceanRacingSuit/31691/view/2164
This is good too, but you'd need something waterproof over it (like maybe a Gore-Tex Bivy Sack)
http://marmot.com/spring_2009/mens/outerwear/insulated/8000m_suit/info/details
The whole point of taking a shelter and sleeping bag is to get out of the winter clothes that are either A) Sweaty; B) Soaking Wet; or C) Both. When you stop for the night your body temperature will drop because you are not moving around. Fall asleep outside in the fishing suit or a snow suit and you'll get a crappy night sleep at best. At worse you'll die from hypothermia. A sleeping bag harnesses the core temperature and the dead air keeps your arms and legs warm. Your arms and legs will be much colder with just wearing a suit to sleep in because the blood going into the extremities will slow down.
Eventually the body just says "F-it, I'm not pumping blood to the freakin' arms because it just comes back cold. I'm gonna save my heart and brain and give this dumbass gangrene."
It's also not that innovative. It looks like a ski jacket and mountaineering pants I bought about 10 years ago. It's not even Gore-Tex. Some no-name "waterproof/breathable" material...probably the same crap they put in our ski patrol jackets.
I'd trust a high-altitude mountaineering snowsuit before I tried that fishing suit.
Oh yeah...the tent. It creates a dead air space that helps reduce the effects of windchill. So with the suit you got an inch or so dead air between you and -30 degree winds...and in the tent it's a toasty 5 above.
Edit: I have no idea about what the Nazis used. I have a book on WWII uniforms and gear someplace. I'll check it out. On the other hand...Wouldn't it be better to see what the Russians used? After all, the Krauts got their butts kicked on the Eastern Front. (Is it something like a bivy-sack?)
Additionally: In the worse case scenario you could always just bury yourself in a snow cave like a polar bear. In that event, a suit like this would have some practical applications, but I still don't think it's ideal.
More: I bet this is warmer:
http://www.mountainhardwear.com/Product.aspx?top=1621&prod=1311&cat=1662&viewAll=False
I bet this kicks butt too:
http://www.hellyhansen.com/product/OnePieces/OceanRacingSuit/31691/view/2164
This is good too, but you'd need something waterproof over it (like maybe a Gore-Tex Bivy Sack)
http://marmot.com/spring_2009/mens/outerwear/insulated/8000m_suit/info/details
cold weather tent camping. any helpful suggestions would be great?
my45tysond
the temp should get down below 40 degrees my concern is keeping warm. suggestions on sleeping bags & tents that retain heat there seems to be such a variance in price on this Equipment
Answer
Some good advice above on the peeing before you go to sleep.
I wouldn't call 40 degrees exactly "cold weather camping"-- in fact that's a not uncommon overnight temperature in the Spring and Fall. I've backpacked in temps as low as 20 below zero and used to teach winter mountaineering skills so I'll give you some tips.
The best all round sleeping system is to use multiple bags layered together. An excellent source to start with is the Campmor catalog (http://www.campmor.com) which has a huge variety of bags and pads and good charts for comparing weights, dimensions and features. They often have dicontinued models which are quite affordable. I recommend that people starting out get a 20 degree rated mummy bag. Get down-filled if you can afford it and/or will be carrying it backpacking or bicycle touring because it will pack lighter and smaller. If you are on a budget or will be using it for a lot of wet weather camping or canoe or kayak touring, get polyester fill. This bag, with the proper ground pad, will keep you comfortable down to between 30 or 40 degrees, depending on how susceptible you are to cold. Bear in mind that most temp ratings on bags are a little optimistic, like by at least 10 degrees. Second, buy a lightweight slightly larger bag, probably an oversized mummy or even a rectangular bag, single layer polyfill and rated around 35 to 45 degrees --a "summer" bag in other words. Once you have these two bags you are ready for anything. In mild Spring and Fall trips you can use the 20 degree mummy, on warm Summer trips take the single layer 40 degree bag and for cold trips take both and put the mummy inside the larger bag.
Another addition if you really tend to sleep cold is to get a very lightweight polartec fleece bag (you can find these for around $20 in most sporting goods stores or Campmor or even make one yourself by folding a cheap fleece blanket in half and sewing across the bottom and half way up the side.) This can be tucked inside the inner bag for more warmth and is also handy around camp as a blanket to wrap around you in the evening (do be careful around campfires as these tend to be flammable -- a very light wool blanket is safer around fire or stoves.)
The advantage of the multiple bags is you can tailor the temp to your needs. If you wake up too warm at night (and this actually even happens on cold nights) you can slip the mummy out of the overbag and cool down a bit. The two lighter weight bags are also easier to carry than one large heavy winter-rated bag. I switched to this system 25 years ago and it has served me well. Lighter bags are also easier to launder in a regular washing machine than a big winter bag.
Your ground pad is highly important too -- you should use thin closed cell foam on the bottom (one common brand is called ensolite but you can also use the thin closed-cell pads they sell for yoga mats). This will block cold and heat transfer. Then put a thicker more comfortable foam pad on top for comfort. DON'T use an air mattress -- they actually will make you colder since they allow air movement and heat transfer.
Wear longjohns to sleep in, NOT COTTON but rather merino wool or wicking synthetic -- lightweight fleece athletic pants and top or even fleece lounge pajamas can work, plus a cap (I prefer a soft polartech fleece one) and fleece socks. Don't try to sleep wearing heavy bulky clothes. They will restrict circulation and make you uncomfortable. Some people just roll up their pile jacket to make a pillow but I prefer to carry a small polyfill pillow with a fleece cover that rolls up into it's own stuffsack. Besides for comfort, the pillow also helps block heat loss out the top of the bag. Some people recommend the "hot water bottle" technique but I've seen too many people have leaks and wet bags -- bring some of those chemical heat packs and tuck one in a sock or mitten and put it down near your feet if you need a little more warmth.
Actually, a backpacking tent can be very warm and cozy during a cold night. Because it is a small space, your body heat builds up fairly rapidly. I've never felt like we needed any artificial heat source in the tent no matter how cold it was. The hardest thing is getting up in the morning out of your toasty sleeping bag. That's another benefit of the two bag system -- you can tuck your clothes between the bags for extra warmth and to keep them warm for dressing the next day.
Happy camping! The great thing about sub-freezing camping is no bugs and you can carry most any food you want without it spoiling.
Some good advice above on the peeing before you go to sleep.
I wouldn't call 40 degrees exactly "cold weather camping"-- in fact that's a not uncommon overnight temperature in the Spring and Fall. I've backpacked in temps as low as 20 below zero and used to teach winter mountaineering skills so I'll give you some tips.
The best all round sleeping system is to use multiple bags layered together. An excellent source to start with is the Campmor catalog (http://www.campmor.com) which has a huge variety of bags and pads and good charts for comparing weights, dimensions and features. They often have dicontinued models which are quite affordable. I recommend that people starting out get a 20 degree rated mummy bag. Get down-filled if you can afford it and/or will be carrying it backpacking or bicycle touring because it will pack lighter and smaller. If you are on a budget or will be using it for a lot of wet weather camping or canoe or kayak touring, get polyester fill. This bag, with the proper ground pad, will keep you comfortable down to between 30 or 40 degrees, depending on how susceptible you are to cold. Bear in mind that most temp ratings on bags are a little optimistic, like by at least 10 degrees. Second, buy a lightweight slightly larger bag, probably an oversized mummy or even a rectangular bag, single layer polyfill and rated around 35 to 45 degrees --a "summer" bag in other words. Once you have these two bags you are ready for anything. In mild Spring and Fall trips you can use the 20 degree mummy, on warm Summer trips take the single layer 40 degree bag and for cold trips take both and put the mummy inside the larger bag.
Another addition if you really tend to sleep cold is to get a very lightweight polartec fleece bag (you can find these for around $20 in most sporting goods stores or Campmor or even make one yourself by folding a cheap fleece blanket in half and sewing across the bottom and half way up the side.) This can be tucked inside the inner bag for more warmth and is also handy around camp as a blanket to wrap around you in the evening (do be careful around campfires as these tend to be flammable -- a very light wool blanket is safer around fire or stoves.)
The advantage of the multiple bags is you can tailor the temp to your needs. If you wake up too warm at night (and this actually even happens on cold nights) you can slip the mummy out of the overbag and cool down a bit. The two lighter weight bags are also easier to carry than one large heavy winter-rated bag. I switched to this system 25 years ago and it has served me well. Lighter bags are also easier to launder in a regular washing machine than a big winter bag.
Your ground pad is highly important too -- you should use thin closed cell foam on the bottom (one common brand is called ensolite but you can also use the thin closed-cell pads they sell for yoga mats). This will block cold and heat transfer. Then put a thicker more comfortable foam pad on top for comfort. DON'T use an air mattress -- they actually will make you colder since they allow air movement and heat transfer.
Wear longjohns to sleep in, NOT COTTON but rather merino wool or wicking synthetic -- lightweight fleece athletic pants and top or even fleece lounge pajamas can work, plus a cap (I prefer a soft polartech fleece one) and fleece socks. Don't try to sleep wearing heavy bulky clothes. They will restrict circulation and make you uncomfortable. Some people just roll up their pile jacket to make a pillow but I prefer to carry a small polyfill pillow with a fleece cover that rolls up into it's own stuffsack. Besides for comfort, the pillow also helps block heat loss out the top of the bag. Some people recommend the "hot water bottle" technique but I've seen too many people have leaks and wet bags -- bring some of those chemical heat packs and tuck one in a sock or mitten and put it down near your feet if you need a little more warmth.
Actually, a backpacking tent can be very warm and cozy during a cold night. Because it is a small space, your body heat builds up fairly rapidly. I've never felt like we needed any artificial heat source in the tent no matter how cold it was. The hardest thing is getting up in the morning out of your toasty sleeping bag. That's another benefit of the two bag system -- you can tuck your clothes between the bags for extra warmth and to keep them warm for dressing the next day.
Happy camping! The great thing about sub-freezing camping is no bugs and you can carry most any food you want without it spoiling.
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